chris_uk
Premium Member
Registered: 8th Jul 03
User status: Offline
|
you should of wound the bolt back in and then sprayed it.. then wind it out, then back in a bit, out a bit more than back in repeat until it comes out.
|
BeetleGav
Member
Registered: 27th Jun 10
Location: lancashire, nelson
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Kyle T
soaked them all in my magic penetrating fluid
bit of a different technique for working on the car! jizzing on it 
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by chris_uk
you should of wound the bolt back in and then sprayed it.. then wind it out, then back in a bit, out a bit more than back in repeat until it comes out.
Aye, few things I could have/should have done - like have a lie in and not bother 
I've been reading and apparently the issue is steel bolts in an aluminum caliper - recipe for seizing. I've gone through my receipts, and I don't think the disks have ever been changed on this car, so 8 years of hot/cold/hot along with a good dose of salty water and shit.
I've also seen that the bracket isn't actually threaded, just the caliper - so what I could do is remove the top bolt, then the caliper would just come out of the bracket with the snapped bolt stuck in place - and then at least I'd have the option of taking the caliper to a garage or whatever to get drilled/coiled... hell maybe I could even grind some flats onto the bolt and wrench it off. Godspeed Brakes even offer a £30 overnight return service on drilling bolts out of Brembo's - it's that common 
The fact I'm booked in at a decent garage on Thursday makes me just want to leave it alone though. I don't need the car for work next week, so I can just leave it sat and then limp the 40 miles to the garage on Thursday morning.
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by BeetleGav
quote:
Originally posted by Kyle T
soaked them all in my magic penetrating fluid
bit of a different technique for working on the car! jizzing on it
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
AndyCorsaSport
Member
Registered: 12th Feb 06
Location: Horsforth, West Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Im sure after 40k on an impreza it will have had the discs changed before now.
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by AndyCorsaSport
Im sure after 40k on an impreza it will have had the discs changed before now.
I assumed so, got receipts for everything minus discs though! Still a pretty moot point though 
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Some time between my last post, and now - I decided that this car isn't taking me without a fight.
I worked out that if I disconnected the hub from the suspension strut, that I could get my impact gun on the last remaining caliper bolt. Luckily I had anti-seized the strut bolts when doing the suspension change so they came off easy!
With the hub disconnected, I got the impact gun on and battered off the top caliper bolt - so now the only thing holding the caliper to the hub was the shaft of the broken bottom bolt.
I removed the pads from the caliper, which should give me enough wiggle-room to get the disk off the hub, and once that's off - I should be able to remove the caliper.
With the caliper off, I can have a proper go at extracting the bolt - thinking about grinding a couple of flats on it and going to work with more penetration and molegrips. If I can't get it off, at least I can easily drive the caliper to a garage and have them do it.
Unfortunately the disc is also stuck to the hub, but there are two 8mm bolt holes intended for screwing in a couple of bolts which will drive the disc off of the hub... only thing I'm missing are the 8mm bolts
The car is currently sat with one corner cocked up in the air on a stand with the wheel and my tools locked away for the night.
Jobs for tomorrow:
Buy some 8mm bolts
Buy a replacement caliper bolt (if I can't, I'll order one from Subaru and just complete the job mid-week)
Pop the disc off
Take caliper off
Try and extract the bolt
If I find a replacement caliper bolt, I've got a choice of either putting a new disc, new pads and new hoses (I'll have to bleed anyway as the caliper will have been off) and also doing the other side - or I can put the old stuff back on if I'm time/daylight restricted and have RH do it all on Thursday.
Here's how it's sat:
Padless caliper...
Shims, pins and clip ready for clean-up...
New vs Old. Fronts aren't too bad, rears are shocking
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
corsav6_mut
Member
Registered: 17th Feb 10
Location: lincoln
User status: Offline
|
Brembo's are sooo shit if they haven't been looked after. I ended up having to take my pins out with an angle grinder. Fucking Italians!
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Yep, can't say I disagree based on my experience so far!
I think I'll get a full set of replacement bolts, and make sure they're put back in with the appropriate anti-seize so hopefully I'll have more luck next time around.
My pins came out dead easy luckily, just a quick tap with a punch and then pushed the clip in whilst sliding them out the rest of the way with long-nose pliers.
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
John
Member
Registered: 30th Jun 03
User status: Offline
|
Normally you just need a bigger hammer/leaver/more heat.
Any time I've given up, as soon as my dad/brother come round they just use some more brute force and ignorance and it comes out.
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Unfortunately on this occasion I think brute force is what hurt me
I was a bit cocky going into this, when I did the suspension change I was jumping up and down on a breaker bar to loosen the strut bolts and the bolts took it like a champ. This time round I didn't even consider the fact the bolt might snap, so I went into it a bit heavy handed.
I've since read that if you loosen a bolt and it begins tightening up again (like this one did), it's a dead-cert the thing is going to snap. I should have backed it back in with penetrating fluid, then out again a few times.
Ah well, all part of learning!
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Quite a productive day today!
Got up bright and early to jack up the other front corner, get that wheel off and then at least change the brake hoses.
Passenger side hose came off easily as so:
New one to go on:
The driver side felt like it was going to round off, so I left it for now.
I dismantled the strut/hub connection on the driver side so I could get the rattlegun on the caliper bolts there. Once again the top bolt whizzed off with minimal effort but the bottom bolt wouldn't budge. Soaked it with the dregs of my penetrating fluid and then went for a brew.
Once Halfords opened at 10am, I went to get some 8mm bolts to prise off the discs - oh and more penetrating fluid. Went for "plus gas" this time which is supposed to be the dogs baws.
Got home, "plus gassed" the bottom bolt and then went to work with the disc on the passenger side. It popped off easily, but the caliper was still stopping me from removing it completely. I eventually sussed this by battering the bracket with a hammer so that it would slide over yesterdays snapped bolt. That worked, disc and caliper off!
Back to the driver side, the bottom bolt still wasn't shifting and I could smell a lot of burning from the rattle gun. Got my breaker bar on it, and jacked the handle up with the trolley jack. PING! Snapped bolt # 2
I was relieved to have snapped this one finally, it clearly wasn't coming out.
Both Calipers finally off:
You can see the snapped bolts here:
The driver side one was significantly longer in the caliper - this would be important later.
I was all ready to clean up and settle down for the afternoon, with the intention of taking the calipers round a few places tomorrow. I got in to find a PM on the 22b forums from Steven of SD Motorsports (builder, owner and driver of "the Banana" http://lateralperformance.co.uk/page.php/news/c0b1ccbf9f59e0f852976955f74c8877#news20)
He's quite local to me, and he offered to help me separate my caliper from it's bolts; jumped in the (other) car with the calipers and went to see Steven.
The longer bolt came out quite easy, he blasted it with a torch and then removed it with a nifty little socket thing which gripped on the stud as he turned it. Ran a tap through the thread to clean it, job done.
Next one was a PITA though, the socket couldn't grip on it so welded about half a dozen bolts onto it - all snapped off when trying to undo it.
Eventually ground the bolt off level with the caliper and drilled it out. The thread however would not budge when we got to it, it was actually stronger than both the steel of the bolt and the aluminum of the caliper - the chemical reaction caused by the different materials, temperature cycles and salty water just turned it all into a single piece of metal - crazy stuff.
Eventually the thread came out:
Unfortunately the female thread was fucked, and Steven didn't have the right sized helicoil - so I left the caliper with him and he's going to sort it tomorrow. Hopefully I'll also sort some new bolts tomorrow too. I also mentioned the hose bolt which felt like it was rounding, so he told me to get a proper spanner for it - it's a flared 10mm spanner rather than the open ended thing I was using before. Grabbed one of those on the way home.
Got home with the "good" caliper and decided to rebuild that side, I could hang the caliper on with one of my remaining good bolts and then take the other bolt around some shops tomorrow.
Discs, new vs the olds:
Cleaned and greased:
Forgot to get a photo of the disc on the car, but I'm sure you can use your imagination 
Caliper loaded up with pads, and clip:
Last job was the hose on the driver side with my new spanner, it worked a treat - so both front hoses are also swapped.
Car is down on it's wheels, but obviously undrivable without a caliper  Will keep it parked up, if I get the caliper and bolts tomorrow - I should be able to rebuild the driver side on tuesday night and then bleed the system. I've not even touched the rears yet, I'm happy with myself now I've pretty much gone through the motions of a brake change - so I might just let RH do it on thursday if I get the car back on the road in time
Constructive weekend... I think
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Bit of wheeler dealering to finish the weekend.
Paid £250 for that centre section and backbox, just sold the backbox for £225 tonight...
Was just about to order a new second decat pipe from Scoobyworld (£110), then thought to check ScoobyNet classified - one on there brand new for £75 posted... it's the exact scoobyworld one too, so hopefully that sale goes through and my blowy exhaust will be sorted
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
3CorsaMeal
Member
Registered: 11th Apr 02
User status: Offline
|
Thats a lot of copper grease
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Aye. I "painted" a lot of it onto the bolt threads and scraped a fair bit of the excess off... got most of it on my hands though so decided against a photoshoot
I probably still had a bit much on though as I saw some squelch out when the wheel was torqued back up.
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
DannyB
Premium Member
Registered: 6th Feb 08
User status: Offline
|
No need to put any on there at all, put the disc on then put a small ring around the centre hole.
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
I followed the instructions, honest!
Nothing is torqued down yet as I'm still missing new bolts so I can scrape it all off... will it do any harm though?
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
aslong as your check your wheel nuts are tight the first few times you use it it'll be fine.
It doesnt sound much but all that grease could stop the hub/brake/wheel sitting flush.
It'll soon feckoff with heat though so just check them
PS - Steven doesnt own the Banana, Mark/Lateral does doesnt he?
He is supporting 2 or 3 cars in Time Attack this year though.
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Yep you're right Adam, I spoke to Steven about the Banana tonight and he explained how it was basically the
Lateral shop window. I always assumed since he built and drove it!
Decided tonight with Steven to tap and coil all of the caliper threads at 1.75 instead of 1.5 as finding replacement M12 bolts was proving difficult without ordering in and hence waiting for delivery.
Got the calipers all cleaned up, will touch up a few chips and scratches tomorrow then refit to the car with shiny new bolts.
Will replace the hoses on the rear too and then bleed the full system, I really cba more drama on the rears so I'll let RH do the discs and pads on Thursday
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
Wooo! Victory.
Grabbed 4x M12 x 1.75 50mm bolts at lunch time. Got home at 5 tonight, ready for the grand finale.
Started off by jacking the rear up and getting the back wheels off. PlusGassed up the brake hose connections and then got to work on removing the rubber hoses at the rear.
Before:
After:
(Hose is a bit twisted in that shot, got it all smoothed out though now)
Once both rear hoses were done, I grabbed the nice clean calipers from inside and got to work on the fronts with my new bolts, all copper greased up for course.
Once the front calipers were on and torqued, I put the suspension bolts back in and got those torqued too. Connected the brake hoses next, then got to work installing the pads into the driver side caliper which I was still to do.
Once in and all hooked up, I had one last "nip up" of all brake hose connections and then prepared myself for bleeding... went to grab the 11mm ring spanner. Doh! My 150pc Halfords toolkit doesn't have one
Jumped in the corsa, back to Halfords and 10mins later I was back at the car again. Simon_16v let me down as Bleed-buddy as he was too busy poncing at the gym in his new Clio - so got the missus out, she's seen enough wheeler dealers so she's as experienced as I am with bleeding brakes
She took up the cockpit position whilst I coordinated from the ground. I'd bought a "self bleed" kit but it wasn't a pressurised one, just had a crappy one-way valve which didn't work so we basically bled the old-school way.
The bleeding went easier than expected, the only thing I wish I'd done different is bought a different colour fluid. It was getting dark so I think I wasted a bit of the new fluid waiting for the old stuff to flush out. Oh well, got all four corners bubble-less and the brake peddle felt firm and consistent. Bitch can bleed.
Sent the missus back inside whilst I cleaned all four corners with brake cleaner and lots of water to make sure no brake fluid dribbles remained - then topped up the fluid with what I had left... unfortunately not enough to get to the MAX mark, but above minimum. I'll buy some more fluid tomorrow, do I have to match brands or will any of the same grade be fine?
One more clean up, then wheels on - car lowered and wheels torqued. First time she's been on her wheels since Saturday, but feels like a lifetime ago
Told the cat and my missus that I loved them (in that order) then set off for my test drive. Started with windows down to make sure there were no nasty noises, first test passed.
Ventured out of the estate, tried slowing down from ~20mph - a bit lethargic but the pedal felt solid and there were no odd noises/vibrations.
Went out on some B roads, started picking up speed but didn't do any heavy braking in fear of violating the instructions I got for bedding in.
Car felt absolutely fine, the lethargic initial braking didn't last - so I'm guessing I was just burning off some grease on the pads or something from my hands during the last few days.
Finished up with a blast down the bypass, still no funny noises or feelings - but still not done any HEAVY braking.
I'm pretty chuffed, glad I stuck with it - once again the cost of tools, time and effort has far outweighed the cost of just taking it to a garage - but next time I'll have confidence, the right tools and anti-seized bolts so well worth the effort. The satisfaction is priceless
Still gonna let RH do the rears on Thursday, really CBA
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
Jon_C
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Dec 05
Location: Suffolk
User status: Offline
|
Good work. Well done for sticking with it
|
Jambo
Member
Registered: 8th Sep 01
Location: Maidenhead, Drives: VXR Arctic
User status: Offline
|
Great write up! I'm rebuilding some brakes for mine, no way near as hard as you so far
Although removing all the BenG Red paint off these second hand calipers is laborious and time consuming! Wish I just bought the fully rebuilt calipers now
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Jambo
Great write up! I'm rebuilding some brakes for mine, no way near as hard as you so far
Although removing all the BenG Red paint off these second hand calipers is laborious and time consuming! Wish I just bought the fully rebuilt calipers now
I was reading a refurb guide for the Brembo's t'other day, replacing seals/pistons/nipples/etc - would like to do that at somepoint in the future with a spare set of calipers if I ever come across some cheap... looks like an interesting job
Mine are a bit tatty aesthetically, so could go the full works and obtain some - get them painted, replace the gubbins and then swap over. Not for a while though, I'll wait till these discs need changing at least
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
Wrighty
Member
Registered: 28th Feb 04
Location: Howden
User status: Offline
|
im proud of you
|
Kyle T
Premium Member
Registered: 11th Sep 04
Location: Selby, North Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
I'm doing it all for you... sarcastic bastard
Lotus Elise 111R
Impreza WRX STi
|
