Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
as always providing a sceptical slant on things 
|
Dave A
USER UNDER INVESTIGATION - DO NOT TRADE
Registered: 10th Dec 03
Location: County Durham
User status: Offline
|
wgo did jr and brosters? and how muchos were they?
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
> Racing Developments < in MK. Marks was more than James', because it was the first.
IIRC, they were about £450, but if you look at how close they sit to the pillars when compared to a bolt in, and the quality of the welds/boxes etc, you'll see it's money well spent.
|
dhdev
Member
Registered: 22nd Dec 05
Location: Midlands
User status: Offline
|
safety is not something to compromise on. I have a bolt in cage in mine that is then strategically welded to the shell, for extra strength / safety. You'll be amazed at how much the cage and shell will move relative to each other if its just fixed at the feet of the cage.
25-30kgs is a small price to pay for the safety it provides, my mate would've been a lot worse off it hadn't been for a properly fitted cage.
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
floor 
|
Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
my point is, how do you know the car in that crash wouldve been worse off had the crash happened without a cage?
i think what is needed is a test on a car without a cage and a car with and roll them over a few times see what difference it actually makes.
I understand a cage is vital in race or rally cars that are doing 120+ through corners, but in your average road crash where you roll it at 50, 60, 70...? i wouldnt mind seeing a test on it
|
Greg_M
Member
Registered: 2nd Sep 03
Location: Grantham, Lincolnshire
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Robin
=IIRC, they were about £450, but if you look at how close they sit to the pillars when compared to a bolt in, and the quality of the welds/boxes etc, you'll see it's money well spent.
is that welded in for £450?
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
yes, bolt in was more, as they have to make the flanges, AND weld plates to the car too.
|
dhdev
Member
Registered: 22nd Dec 05
Location: Midlands
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
my point is, how do you know the car in that crash wouldve been worse off had the crash happened without a cage?
i think what is needed is a test on a car without a cage and a car with and roll them over a few times see what difference it actually makes.
I understand a cage is vital in race or rally cars that are doing 120+ through corners, but in your average road crash where you roll it at 50, 60, 70...? i wouldnt mind seeing a test on it
If you're reffering to my above post, then the deformation of the cage is testament to the amount of force that it has taken, therefore I can without any doubt say that yes he was better off with a cage.
|
Greg_M
Member
Registered: 2nd Sep 03
Location: Grantham, Lincolnshire
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Robin
yes, bolt in was more, as they have to make the flanges, AND weld plates to the car too.
 thanks i shall give them a call tomorrow
|
K3 VMU
Member
Registered: 28th Jul 06
Location: Portlethen, Aberdeen,ken
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
my point is, how do you know the car in that crash wouldve been worse off had the crash happened without a cage?
i think what is needed is a test on a car without a cage and a car with and roll them over a few times see what difference it actually makes.
I understand a cage is vital in race or rally cars that are doing 120+ through corners, but in your average road crash where you roll it at 50, 60, 70...? i wouldnt mind seeing a test on it
i think my mates car crash is pretty good evidence?
if it wasnt for the cage,the roof would have been flat-and no doubt caused a death
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
they might be cheaper Greg, I'm going on memory
|
Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by dhdev
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
my point is, how do you know the car in that crash wouldve been worse off had the crash happened without a cage?
i think what is needed is a test on a car without a cage and a car with and roll them over a few times see what difference it actually makes.
I understand a cage is vital in race or rally cars that are doing 120+ through corners, but in your average road crash where you roll it at 50, 60, 70...? i wouldnt mind seeing a test on it
If you're reffering to my above post, then the deformation of the cage is testament to the amount of force that it has taken, therefore I can without any doubt say that yes he was better off with a cage.
yeah, maybe in that situation it did work???
a cars chassis is more than adequate to handle a few rolls on its own
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
There's your answer Steve, if that 106 had a full cage, it would have been 106 shape still.
|
Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by K3 VMU
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
my point is, how do you know the car in that crash wouldve been worse off had the crash happened without a cage?
i think what is needed is a test on a car without a cage and a car with and roll them over a few times see what difference it actually makes.
I understand a cage is vital in race or rally cars that are doing 120+ through corners, but in your average road crash where you roll it at 50, 60, 70...? i wouldnt mind seeing a test on it
i think my mates car crash is pretty good evidence?
if it wasnt for the cage,the roof would have been flat-and no doubt caused a death
no those pictures prove nothing as we have seen pictures of an almost identical crash in a saxo wthout a cage and it looked no different, all the force in those pics was absorbed by the b pillar
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
also, I don't think Dave was after one for the life saving bit, he is after the stiffening thing.
|
Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Robin
There's your answer Steve, if that 106 had a full cage, it would have been 106 shape still.
yep i think with a full cage the front top of the car would have stayed rigid, i still dont thinkt he driver would have come off any worse or better
|
Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Robin
also, I don't think Dave was after one for the life saving bit, he is after the stiffening thing.
oh yes without a doubt there is handling advantages to be gained
|
Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
im not trying to say rollcages are bad or dont help, im saying people come along and post pictures of crashes and say rollcages saved there lives, which might not necessarily be true.
I have seen a lot of crashes where people have walked away from a rolled car fine with no roll cage
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
yeah, definitely, but i reckon any deformation of the passenger compartment is bad, so a FULL cage, which prevents this, is likely to be better, as you cannot be hit by a random bit of pillar.
i do see your point though 
|
K3 VMU
Member
Registered: 28th Jul 06
Location: Portlethen, Aberdeen,ken
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
im not trying to say rollcages are bad or dont help, im saying people come along and post pictures of crashes and say rollcages saved there lives, which might not necessarily be true.
I have seen a lot of crashes where people have walked away from a rolled car fine with no roll cage
 yes but there IS situations when a cage will save your life,i believe that my mates was one of them, but thats imo.
|
jr
Member
Registered: 20th May 02
Location: Kent
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Robin
> Racing Developments < in MK. Marks was more than James', because it was the first.
IIRC, they were about £450, but if you look at how close they sit to the pillars when compared to a bolt in, and the quality of the welds/boxes etc, you'll see it's money well spent.
this is very true, which annoyed mark
|
Nic Barnes
Member
Registered: 5th Apr 04
Location: nowhere near ginger people
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
im not trying to say rollcages are bad or dont help, im saying people come along and post pictures of crashes and say rollcages saved there lives, which might not necessarily be true.
I have seen a lot of crashes where people have walked away from a rolled car fine with no roll cage
once again making an argument for no reason
|
broster
Premium Member
Registered: 6th Dec 02
Location: Drives: E39
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by jr
quote:
Originally posted by Robin
> Racing Developments < in MK. Marks was more than James', because it was the first.
IIRC, they were about £450, but if you look at how close they sit to the pillars when compared to a bolt in, and the quality of the welds/boxes etc, you'll see it's money well spent.
this is very true, which annoyed mark
its the material that made mine more costly, when i had mine done i wanted it done asap, they only had (enter some tube name here) which was more costly, and they wernt to keen on using it up, so i paid a premium 
i would deffo use them again, but then again, danny bates makes some ace cages, and his fab work is fantastic, amazes me every time i go to his workshop.
so there is deffo something worth looking into.
two companies to try:
racing developments
adreniline race and performance
both have plus points, danny builds drag cars and preps cars for anything, racing developments build and race their own 750cc stock hatch cars and prepare many other cars.
also mark from racing develoments is a composite engineer so he can make you fancy stuff from carbon 
|
Steve
Premium Member
Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by muppetsport
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
im not trying to say rollcages are bad or dont help, im saying people come along and post pictures of crashes and say rollcages saved there lives, which might not necessarily be true.
I have seen a lot of crashes where people have walked away from a rolled car fine with no roll cage
once again making an argument for no reason
im not arguing ffs
|
