Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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quote:
Originally posted by Cosmo
quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
I think the boat has been missed to make some really good gains now on banks... you can still make more, but you could've made a small fortune if you had the balls to buy when it was looking grim.
Rubbish, of course a huge gain has been made since they were at their lowest, but they still have massive (more than they have done from their lowest to now) growth potential in the next 12-18months.
Yeah although, if the 'W' shaped recession that's predicted happens, you'll end up shitting yourself when it all drops again.
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: Im the real one!
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quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
quote:
Originally posted by Cosmo
quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
I think the boat has been missed to make some really good gains now on banks... you can still make more, but you could've made a small fortune if you had the balls to buy when it was looking grim.
Rubbish, of course a huge gain has been made since they were at their lowest, but they still have massive (more than they have done from their lowest to now) growth potential in the next 12-18months.
Yeah although, if the 'W' shaped recession that's predicted happens, you'll end up shitting yourself when it all drops again.
The big banks wont head down again now, all signs (increase in both commercial and personal lending and spending) are pointing towards a recovery and not a W shaped recession.
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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They said it'd never go down in the first place
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GF-91
Banned
Registered: 8th Jul 09
Location: Burnley!
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What is the minimum purchase for shares? and how long do you have to have them before you cash them in?
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: Im the real one!
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I dont think they said never, but certainly didnt expect it 
Things are starting to look a lot rosier now though.
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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quote:
Originally posted by Cosmo
I dont think they said never, but certainly didnt expect it
Things are starting to look a lot rosier now though.
They believed they had cracked the secret to never having a 'boom and bust'.
My theory is that in fact, this is just a temp rise... 'things aren't as bad as people thought they would be' - so it's rising slightly... plus certain industries / banks etc have had a lot of money pumped into them which is helping sustain them ... (scrappage scheme for cars for example).
But as more people remain unemployed, more students get into higher debt without the job opportunities, people can't pay credit cards or mortgages and default on their loans and generally the rest of the world realises how useless / unimportant the uk is...
Then who knows what will happen in the future... Plus China = the up and coming super power still.
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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quote:
Originally posted by Hammer
Lieutenant Dan got me invested in some kind of fruit company. So then I got a call from him, saying we don't have to worry about money no more. And I said, that's good! One less thing.
Why hasn't anybody else picked up on this?!
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J da Silva
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Registered: 10th Apr 03
Location: The FACTory
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The best building firm to invest money in shares is probably Barratt Homes, but do it now if you want to take my advice, they definately aren't going under and are starting to build more stockplots.
I have a fair bit of ££ in Barratts aswell as other companies of similar natures and they've given me the best returns as of yet.
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Skylined
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Registered: 27th Sep 05
Location: Sideways, Surrey
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WS Atkins has gone up 9% since i invested in June time
Serco has gone up 14% since I invested in July
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: Im the real one!
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quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
quote:
Originally posted by Cosmo
I dont think they said never, but certainly didnt expect it
Things are starting to look a lot rosier now though.
They believed they had cracked the secret to never having a 'boom and bust'.
My theory is that in fact, this is just a temp rise... 'things aren't as bad as people thought they would be' - so it's rising slightly... plus certain industries / banks etc have had a lot of money pumped into them which is helping sustain them ... (scrappage scheme for cars for example).
But as more people remain unemployed, more students get into higher debt without the job opportunities, people can't pay credit cards or mortgages and default on their loans and generally the rest of the world realises how useless / unimportant the uk is...
Then who knows what will happen in the future... Plus China = the up and coming super power still.
Its a tough one to call, but I can see why you'd have that view.
Personally, my opinion is that a lot of the largest banks in the UK (and world now tbh) are being propped up by Govt. money, and thus have strict guidelines on not only who to lend to (so more careful) but also a target of the amount they have to lend, thus making the general money market get back to normal levels.
People are making more of this unemployment than it actually is IMO. Ive said it in a past thread (and people went mad), but this recession has been a good (great?) thing for the economy in the long run as it has taught firms how to run themselves more efficiently. Previously they'd of employed 5 people to do what 3 can do, now they will have 3 and they will hopefully carry this on when the economy is back to its best.
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Skylined
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Registered: 27th Sep 05
Location: Sideways, Surrey
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So what are the millions of unemployed people now supposed to do if the 'recovered' economy doesn't need them?
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: Im the real one!
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quote:
Originally posted by Skylined
So what are the millions of unemployed people now supposed to do if the 'recovered' economy doesn't need them?
I didnt go in to it as much as I did last time, so let me explain a little more...
Our economy as it was pre-recession was extremely inefficient, compared to a lot of foreign countries we had 2 people doing the job of 1 foreigner. Our companies were making less money, and in a less solid footing when the recession took hold. This is one of the main reasons this country has been hit one of the worst since the down turn - and it is why we'll be one of the last to fully recover from it.
Had, pre-recession, we been efficient, you'd of seen a lot more profitable and well run companies in this country, and therefore you'd of seen a lot less people unemployed as they are now as those companies would of been able to ride out the recession keeping them in employment.
You've also got to remember that a lot (not all before you jump on that bandwagon) of the newly unemployed are coming from these inefficient companies, and they were the most inefficient people in that company (hence why the were the ones to go) so some only have themselves to blame. Others will of been the victim of a poorly run company who employed them, but they'll be the ones who will go out and find themselves a job and work themselves back up again.
So in answer to your question, the economy will always (even in the hard times) need the hard workers, especially in a recovered economy. And my only sorrow is that we have to pay for those in this country who wont work hard and will happily settle for hand outs.
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Skylined
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Registered: 27th Sep 05
Location: Sideways, Surrey
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quote:
Originally posted by Cosmo
quote:
Originally posted by Skylined
So what are the millions of unemployed people now supposed to do if the 'recovered' economy doesn't need them?
I didnt go in to it as much as I did last time, so let me explain a little more...
Our economy as it was pre-recession was extremely inefficient, compared to a lot of foreign countries we had 2 people doing the job of 1 foreigner. Our companies were making less money, and in a less solid footing when the recession took hold. This is one of the main reasons this country has been hit one of the worst since the down turn - and it is why we'll be one of the last to fully recover from it.
Had, pre-recession, we been efficient, you'd of seen a lot more profitable and well run companies in this country, and therefore you'd of seen a lot less people unemployed as they are now as those companies would of been able to ride out the recession keeping them in employment.
You've also got to remember that a lot (not all before you jump on that bandwagon) of the newly unemployed are coming from these inefficient companies, and they were the most inefficient people in that company (hence why the were the ones to go) so some only have themselves to blame. Others will of been the victim of a poorly run company who employed them, but they'll be the ones who will go out and find themselves a job and work themselves back up again.
So in answer to your question, the economy will always (even in the hard times) need the hard workers, especially in a recovered economy. And my only sorrow is that we have to pay for those in this country who wont work hard and will happily settle for hand outs.
Don't you think this 'efficient' workforce has been pushed to it's limit though?
I mean that, companies have been forced to reduce costs, meaning laying people off and making the rest of the people cover their job - making them do more for the same pay, and generally be unhappy at work about the extra amount of work they have to do.
I think that when this recession is over, companies won't have the excuse of 'we'll go bust' anymore and said unhappy and overworked employees will kick off and want to return to their previous tasks.
Opinions?
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Haimsey
Premium Member
Registered: 8th May 05
Location: Nottingham Drives: Corsa B
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Where do you buy shares/invest?
Marcy Marc 
White Sport Progress Thread
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Skylined
Member
Registered: 27th Sep 05
Location: Sideways, Surrey
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share.com
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Toby
Premium Member
Registered: 29th Nov 05
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quote:
Originally posted by GaryF
What is the minimum purchase for shares? and how long do you have to have them before you cash them in?
totally depends on what your purchasing. short selling is not really done anymore.
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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quote:
Originally posted by Cosmo
but this recession has been a good (great?) thing for the economy in the long run as it has taught firms how to run themselves more efficiently. Previously they'd of employed 5 people to do what 3 can do, now they will have 3 and they will hopefully carry this on when the economy is back to its best.
I do agree quite strongly with this point... the reality is, most offices are full of people browsing sites like CS / Facebook when they should be working...
When I went travelling around the world, you could see how hard different people on the bread line world work to make a few pence!
We get good salaries, for 'relatively' easy office jobs and what do we do for that? decide to be fairly unproductive, instead surfing social network sites and achieving maybe 23-50% productivity of what they should be capable of.
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J da Silva
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Registered: 10th Apr 03
Location: The FACTory
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I agree with Cosmo, as firsthand, I own a business and had alot of people working for it that didn't really need to be there, it's only since the recession I've found out that cutting jobs and getting the workforce that is left to cover all that, but I haven't done it unrewarded, they've been looked after.
When you run a medium sized firm, cutting wage bills doesn't always save you money, it's how you man-manage the staff you employ, if you look after people, they look after you.
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: Im the real one!
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quote:
Originally posted by J da Silva
I agree with Cosmo, as firsthand, I own a business and had alot of people working for it that didn't really need to be there, it's only since the recession I've found out that cutting jobs and getting the workforce that is left to cover all that, but I haven't done it unrewarded, they've been looked after.
One of the last businesses we bought was turning over a huge amount of money for the size shop it was, but the stupid woman running it had about twice the workforce she needed to do so which meant she was practically going to go out of business when we bought it. Its cost us a fortune to try to bring the costs down and its still I think 1/3 to 1/2 of the staff just arent needed.
There are millions of companies like that out there who didnt look after themselves when things were nice and easy for them and are regretting it now.
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
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quote:
Originally posted by Skylined
Don't you think this 'efficient' workforce has been pushed to it's limit though?
I mean that, companies have been forced to reduce costs, meaning laying people off and making the rest of the people cover their job - making them do more for the same pay, and generally be unhappy at work about the extra amount of work they have to do.
I think that when this recession is over, companies won't have the excuse of 'we'll go bust' anymore and said unhappy and overworked employees will kick off and want to return to their previous tasks.
Opinions?
The point is they arent being pushed to their limit, as previously they were doing 50% of what they could/should be doing, and now they are doing 100% of what they can/should be - and thats how being employed should be.
What you are suggesting is people who are working arent happy to work hard and should only be working to less than full efficiency - that is how this country has got into this worse shite than a lot of similar sized countries currently.
What I would say if employees kick off is fine, fuck off. Once they go their are a lot of unemployed people out there who will be willing to step in and replace them.
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: Im the real one!
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Oh, and as for where to do trade dealing, I use fool.co.uk
Set up a Stocks and Shares ISA with them and pay money into that, you wont pay any interest on profit you make then. If you also do it via the Share Builder package you'll pay very little in charges for buying and selling.
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Bart
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Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
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I would much rather be unahppy in my well paid job then unemployed like a few people close to me.
Also, if your having to take on extra work and you cope, then you wasnt really working to your full potential previously anyway.
If you can diversify and work bloody hard, you know you have a better chance of being safe.
Cosmo is quite right, that nearly every company was over indulging when things were good, buying better vehicles, computers, tools etc.
[Edited on 05-09-2009 by Bart]
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Jules S
Premium Member
Registered: 24th Dec 03
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quote:
Originally posted by Cosmo
quote:
Originally posted by J da Silva
I agree with Cosmo, as firsthand, I own a business and had alot of people working for it that didn't really need to be there, it's only since the recession I've found out that cutting jobs and getting the workforce that is left to cover all that, but I haven't done it unrewarded, they've been looked after.
One of the last businesses we bought was turning over a huge amount of money for the size shop it was, but the stupid woman running it had about twice the workforce she needed to do so which meant she was practically going to go out of business when we bought it. Its cost us a fortune to try to bring the costs down and its still I think 1/3 to 1/2 of the staff just arent needed.
There are millions of companies like that out there who didnt look after themselves when things were nice and easy for them and are regretting it now.
So seriously Cosmo.
Ever employed some Polaks?
And if so have they gone back home now the pound/euro has gone tits down?
I'm baffled at your 1/3 ...1/2 comment and it costing you a fortune to bring down costs....
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bishbosh
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Registered: 25th Sep 06
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Im currently looking to buy into RBS, 55p or so
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Cosmo
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: Im the real one!
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quote:
Originally posted by Jules S
So seriously Cosmo.
Ever employed some Polaks?
And if so have they gone back home now the pound/euro has gone tits down?
I'm baffled at your 1/3 ...1/2 comment and it costing you a fortune to bring down costs....
No, I actually dont think we employ any foreign people, well actually we employ a spanish and a greek but they are both married to English fellas and have lived over here for about 30yrs. Neither of those tend to go back anywhere from what I know.
I still think we could get rid of 1/3rd of the workers, or even 1/2, and be able to manage perfectly fine with no drop in turnover (infact the shop has increased its turnover in the 9 months we have owned it).
And as for costing a fortune, the shop has been going for something like 40yrs, and most of the workers have been there at least 8yrs - so to make them redundant has cost a fortune and will probably end up costing us more to get it to where we want it. But its a long run thing we have to look at it as rather than a short term saving.
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