Colin
Member
Registered: 4th Apr 02
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Andrew
Totally had enough, can't be doing with someone standing behind me pushing me to do things.
Surely thats a case for sexual harasement pugnut! 
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Nath
Member
Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Andrew
Handed mine in earlier after walking out at 4pm.
Text went off to manager saying my notice will be on her desk tomorrow morning, an e-mail sent to the owner in France explaining the MD is an arogant tosser... Just had a phone call to arrange a meeting tomorrow.
Totally had enough, can't be doing with someone standing behind me pushing me to do things.
Yo Paul..... This isn't how it's done 
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Pop
Member
Registered: 8th May 03
Location: Reading
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Nath
quote:
Originally posted by Andrew
Handed mine in earlier after walking out at 4pm.
Text went off to manager saying my notice will be on her desk tomorrow morning, an e-mail sent to the owner in France explaining the MD is an arogant tosser... Just had a phone call to arrange a meeting tomorrow.
Totally had enough, can't be doing with someone standing behind me pushing me to do things.
Yo Paul..... This isn't how it's done
Got to agree, you've made a hash of that one Andrew 
Always good to leave on good terms even if you have no intention of ever going back.
[Edited on 24-03-2010 by Pop]
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jr
Member
Registered: 20th May 02
Location: Kent
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Ian
Shouldn't be too difficult a process. I doubt you're so indispensable that they're going to beg you or anything fantasy like that. And if they get pissed off and it makes you sad, be happy that they'll get over it very quickly when the next guy comes in and is equally as good if not better than you were.
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John
Member
Registered: 30th Jun 03
User status: Offline
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Paul, you sound like just the sort of employee people don't want.
You're just in the job market and you know everything.
Andrew, does this mean we won't have to hear about your van anymore?
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stuartmitchell
Member
Registered: 24th Apr 04
Location: Kirkliston, Edinburgh
User status: Offline
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I'd butter them up a bit mate, learnt so much here, will always be greatful, been offered my dream job which feels like the right move blah blah blah. Be honest, if they have valued your service they should acknowledge it! O
It goes without saying that you shouldn't leave your job without having another one to go to aswell!!
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jr
Member
Registered: 20th May 02
Location: Kent
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
quote:
Originally posted by Ian
Shouldn't be too difficult a process. I doubt you're so indispensable that they're going to beg you or anything fantasy like that. And if they get pissed off and it makes you sad, be happy that they'll get over it very quickly when the next guy comes in and is equally as good if not better than you were.
You say that, but the incompetence of this company is the whole reason I want to leave.
You don't really know the situation, but I've already been begged to stay back in Nov when I said I wanted to leave and was given a 5k rise. I know the guy sitting next to me has been through the same process too in the past.
The companies incompetence keeps too much knowledge in people's heads. As new people start, it gets passed down from the existing people to the new people... but the old people have left (because it was shit), leaving only a small number of people who know everything... me and the guy next to me (who wants to leave) included.
That's why I want to leave before he does, as they'll think they can hire and retrain if he's still there to teach them...
If he leaves, I can imagine a massive rush of trying to knowledge transfer before I leave, but 1 month (notice) is far too short to be useful.
everyone ive ever worked for does that ? thought that was just the real world, just puts me in a better postion to neogotiate better £££ because i am the orical (sp)
hence why i was a parts advisor on more than a parts manager
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stuartmitchell
Member
Registered: 24th Apr 04
Location: Kirkliston, Edinburgh
User status: Offline
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Oh nad they cant give you a bad reference but they can decline to give a reference..
I'd be careful about jumping ship too quickly too. A new employer will instantly question why your looking after such a short period of time when applying for jobs in the future.
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Hammer
Member
Registered: 11th Feb 04
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
quote:
Originally posted by Ian
Shouldn't be too difficult a process. I doubt you're so indispensable that they're going to beg you or anything fantasy like that. And if they get pissed off and it makes you sad, be happy that they'll get over it very quickly when the next guy comes in and is equally as good if not better than you were.
You say that, but the incompetence of this company is the whole reason I want to leave.
You don't really know the situation, but I've already been begged to stay back in Nov when I said I wanted to leave and was given a 5k rise. I know the guy sitting next to me has been through the same process too in the past.
The companies incompetence keeps too much knowledge in people's heads. As new people start, it gets passed down from the existing people to the new people... but the old people have left (because it was shit), leaving only a small number of people who know everything... me and the guy next to me (who wants to leave) included.
That's why I want to leave before he does, as they'll think they can hire and retrain if he's still there to teach them...
If he leaves, I can imagine a massive rush of trying to knowledge transfer before I leave, but 1 month (notice) is far too short to be useful.
You've just explained 90% of workplaces the length and breadth of the country. It may not be ideal but it's the way things happen in the real world.
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Whittie
Member
Registered: 11th Aug 06
Location: North Wales Drives: BMW, Corsa & Fiat
User status: Offline
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Naked.
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Paul_J
Member
Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Hammer
quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
quote:
Originally posted by Ian
Shouldn't be too difficult a process. I doubt you're so indispensable that they're going to beg you or anything fantasy like that. And if they get pissed off and it makes you sad, be happy that they'll get over it very quickly when the next guy comes in and is equally as good if not better than you were.
You say that, but the incompetence of this company is the whole reason I want to leave.
You don't really know the situation, but I've already been begged to stay back in Nov when I said I wanted to leave and was given a 5k rise. I know the guy sitting next to me has been through the same process too in the past.
The companies incompetence keeps too much knowledge in people's heads. As new people start, it gets passed down from the existing people to the new people... but the old people have left (because it was shit), leaving only a small number of people who know everything... me and the guy next to me (who wants to leave) included.
That's why I want to leave before he does, as they'll think they can hire and retrain if he's still there to teach them...
If he leaves, I can imagine a massive rush of trying to knowledge transfer before I leave, but 1 month (notice) is far too short to be useful.
You've just explained 90% of workplaces the length and breadth of the country. It may not be ideal but it's the way things happen in the real world.
Maybe that's the reason this country's economy is going so downhill...
I would prefer to work somewhere that works properly... I can't speak for all trades, but in software development good companies tend to adapt / learn / apply proper processes... Bad companies are left in the past and stick to what worked 5-10 years ago 
When I was looking for jobs originally in the heart of the recession - when everyone was telling me I'd not get a job for months, without really trying I had about 3 interviews lined up within a few days and that was in the heart of the recession... My biggest regret was just taking the first offer and not looking around for somewhere good.
End of the day, I've got the quals, experience and knowledge to work somewhere better. I think it's probably better to make the move now while I'm young and have little commitments than wait another year or so when my soul is completely crushed by the stupid ways of this company.
Anyone who says they would stay and get the feet under the table / enjoy the fact the company is incompetent with knowedge should read this: http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Up-or-Out-Solving-the-IT-Turnover-Crisis.aspx
^^ the best have a thirst to learn and get better and move on... The worst get comfortable, feet under the table and stay forever...
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Paul_J
Member
Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
User status: Offline
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and to quote from the above to all that just say 'make do'...
quote:
Bruce did an excellent job of explaining why the unskilled don’t quit:
They tend to be grateful they have a job and make fewer demands on management; even if they find the workplace unpleasant, they are the least likely to be able to find a job elsewhere. They tend to entrench themselves, becoming maintenance experts on critical systems, assuming responsibilities that no one else wants so that the organization can’t afford to let them go.
http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Up-or-Out-Solving-the-IT-Turnover-Crisis.aspx
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Paul_J
Member
Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
User status: Offline
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and the feeling i have
quote:
The reason that skilled employees quit, however, is a bit more complicated. In virtually every job, there is a peak in the overall value (the ratio of productivity to cost) that an employee brings to his company. I call this the Value Apex.
On the first minute of the first day, an employee’s value is effectively zero. As that employee becomes acquainted with his new environment and begins to apply his skills and past experiences, his value quickly grows. This growth continues exponentially while the employee masters the business domain and shares his ideas with coworkers and management.
However, once an employee shares all of his external knowledge, learns all that there is to know about the business, and applies all of his past experiences, the growth stops. That employee, in that particular job, has become all that he can be. He has reached the value apex.
If that employee continues to work in the same job, his value will start to decline. What was once “fresh new ideas that we can’t implement today” become “the same old boring suggestions that we’re never going to do”. Prior solutions to similar problems are greeted with “yeah, we worked on that project, too” or simply dismissed as “that was five years ago, and we’ve all heard the story.” This leads towards a loss of self actualization which ends up chipping away at motivation.
Skilled developers understand this. Crossing the value apex often triggers an innate “probably time for me to move on” feeling and, after a while, leads towards inevitable resentment and an overall dislike of the job. Nothing – not even a team of on-site masseuses – can assuage this loss.
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Limecat
Banned
Registered: 25th Jun 05
Location: The Internet
User status: Offline
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What is with this 'illegal to give a bad reference' bullshit?
If you do not know facts, do not fucking post. Muppets.
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PhilC
Member
Registered: 21st Jan 06
Location: Lancs, UK
User status: Offline
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i-resign.com
My last 2 have come from there!
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Paul_J
Member
Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
User status: Offline
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oops just checked my google mail...
I had a response to a job I randomly applied to a couple of weeks ago, offering me an interview
doh. I've been in malta and haven't been checking it.
Will see if they're still interested
[Edited on 25-03-2010 by Paul_J]
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willay
Moderator
Organiser: South East, National Events
Premium Member
Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
User status: Offline
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You write your notcie to say you are leaving and then say some shit about it being a pleasure to work for and all this crap about good luck in the future.
Then you need to make sure its dated, you need to maybe state your leaving date and you need to sign it.
Then its up to you how you hand it it, I took my boss into the meeting room, said I wasnt happy so going to leave and then gave him the letter.
[Edited on 25-03-2010 by willay]
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Reedy
Member
Registered: 11th Apr 04
Location: Hammersmith
User status: Offline
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if your bothered about the way things are done at work, why dont you propose a new way of doing it? get some decent standards set. It wouldnt be hard to produce a proposal with all the benefits. I take it this company is more of a "If It's Not Broken Don't Fix It" kind of structure and then when something goes wrong with the system its a matter of wing'ing it. You can get some form of standards set where every year or 6 months the current systems produced are evaulated, if its a matter where they are always breaking then it makes sense to make a new one with the new proceedures.
If they dont comply to this then you have a reason to leave and they shouldnt moan about it.
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Andrew
Member
Registered: 5th May 04
Location: Skoda Octavia Estate, Ford Puma
User status: Offline
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I've just been asked to stay making me feel guilty 
Didn't want to go into the office so I'm at home eating bacon butties doing a bit of work.
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Paul_J
Member
Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Reedy
if your bothered about the way things are done at work, why dont you propose a new way of doing it? get some decent standards set. It wouldnt be hard to produce a proposal with all the benefits. I take it this company is more of a "If It's Not Broken Don't Fix It" kind of structure and then when something goes wrong with the system its a matter of wing'ing it. You can get some form of standards set where every year or 6 months the current systems produced are evaulated, if its a matter where they are always breaking then it makes sense to make a new one with the new proceedures.
If they dont comply to this then you have a reason to leave and they shouldnt moan about it.
Basically, that's pretty much what's been happening for a year.
We (the team of devs) propose new ways of how things should be done.
The management take it on board and say 'yes, this sounds fantastic'.
Then nothing happens.
Reality is, to make change, you have to disrupt their current cycle of pumping out things and making money. You can use the 'boy scout' rule to improve things gradually, but you may as well be pissing in the wind with this stuff.
Result is... nothing will ever change... things will only ever get worse. What they'll do is just keep throwing resources at their problems (time / money / people) rather than stopping for a while to fix the fundamental things wrong.
Some people may be happy to work in that situation taking their wage and dealing with the crap.
I personally think I'm capable of better and would learn a lot more from a company that embraces positive suggestions and can see the bigger picture (rather than short term profit).
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Reedy
Member
Registered: 11th Apr 04
Location: Hammersmith
User status: Offline
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If thats the case, surely you can point out to them that they are wasting money by not following standards. I would see it as an oportunity to take over and enforce these standards yourself. If nothing changes then put it to them that you are considering leaving due to your requests not being dealt with. IF they value you that much then things will change, if they dont then you can go out the door without them moaning that you left them in the shite.
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Paul_J
Member
Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
User status: Offline
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wow...
A woman at work just said 'why is it called System32?'
'I wonder if it was their 32nd attempt'  :doyle:
... wow.
[Edited on 25-03-2010 by Paul_J]
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Jambo
Member
Registered: 8th Sep 01
Location: Maidenhead, Drives: VXR Arctic
User status: Offline
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Paul it is no bad thing wanting to work for a company that does things properly. Its not about the real world. There are good companies and companies run badly. They may still make money yes, but its not all about that. The future etc.
paul i wish if i said i was going to leave they would give me a £5k payrise. They would just call me a cunt and try and sack me before the end of my notic period tbh
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Reedy
Member
Registered: 11th Apr 04
Location: Hammersmith
User status: Offline
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what do you do Jambo? and who do you work for?
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Jambo
Member
Registered: 8th Sep 01
Location: Maidenhead, Drives: VXR Arctic
User status: Offline
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Salesman Reedy.
oh and last company i worked for who where woefully inept and pissing money up the wall with all the employees being a bunch of yes men. I stated they where going about it all wrong and it will end badly. Alot of people just said i was being negative and it was a great company etc. 11months after i left company went under.
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