Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
Cheaper in the long run though? How many times does the average criminal go through courts using legal aid? Benefits and all that. How much does it cost to keep them in jail? In terms of food, security guard costs etc.
and how many appeals does someone on death row have? Do you have any idea how expensive it is to sentence someone to death in the usa? .,... on average its about 10 times more expensive to kill someone than to imprison them for life ..... and it normally takes years to actually killm them ...prolonging the misery of the victim and their families even longer ....continually dragging them through court hearings and appeal courts.
It sounds good on paper ..but it isnt easy to put someone to death....and it costs millions and takes years ...and kind of defeats the purpose of punishment. And it certainly doesnt reduce violent or domestic crime .... in the usa the figures show the opposite if anything.
New Jersey introduced the death penalty in 1976, and got rid of it two years ago as it was too expensive, and was having virtually no impact on stopping the increase in murders and violent offences
[Edited on 15-05-2011 by Dr Pepper]
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Dr Pepper
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I just find it funny that in this country many people think the death penalty or corporal punishemt will solve our problems.
Yet in america a number of the states who have the death penalty want to get rid of it ..due to cost and rising crime and murder rates.
At least 8 of the 35 states are currently trying to get the death penalty removed ... many of these states want it removed due to the cost of it, and the others due to the fact that dna evidence is showing that there have been a number of innocent people killed by the state in thelast couple of decades
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sc0ott
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If they were to introduce it here who says it has to be anything like over in the usa.
Some found guilty of manslaughter, rape, etc should have no appeal rights imo. It should be a case of if theyre found guilty they should be punished to suit so they dont do it again.
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sc0ott
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I just find it funny how people use stats and figures from other countries to think it wont work in a country that has a low/slap on the wrist punishment system compared to elsewhere.
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Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
If they were to introduce it here who says it has to be anything like over in the usa.
Some found guilty of manslaughter, rape, etc should have no appeal rights imo. It should be a case of if theyre found guilty they should be punished to suit so they dont do it again.
are you serious? .... you think you should be sentenced to death or abuse without any right to appeal.
Firstly - that could never happen. Secondly - you do realise how many mistakes are made in our courts system...you will have to have appeals. And some people will be found not guilty at appeal.
It will be very much like it is in the usa - it will take years to execute anyone, cost millions more than imprisonment, and you will get very little difference in crime rates.
So what exactly would be the point?
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Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
I just find it funny how people use stats and figures from other countries to think it wont work in a country that has a low/slap on the wrist punishment system compared to elsewhere.
what is a "low/slap on the wrist punishment system" ...I have no idea what you are on about
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Nath
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I wondered how this got to 4 pages.
Then I saw Dr Pepper had posted.
I no longer wonder.
The End.
[Edited on 15-05-2011 by Nath]
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Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by Nath
I wondered how this got to 4 pages.
Then I saw Dr Pepper had posted.
I no long wonder.
The End.
Just offering a different opinion from - "hang the bastards" ....sorry
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sc0ott
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Registered: 16th Feb 09
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They would need to obviously change a shit load to make it work such as more evidance of someone doing the crime before punishment.
Are you for real, why would someone who kills another person have the right to appeal?
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sc0ott
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Registered: 16th Feb 09
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
I just find it funny how people use stats and figures from other countries to think it wont work in a country that has a low/slap on the wrist punishment system compared to elsewhere.
what is a "low/slap on the wrist punishment system" ...I have no idea what you are on about
Prisons with luxuries.
Do you get that in america?
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Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
They would need to obviously change a shit load to make it work such as more evidance of someone doing the crime before punishment.
Are you for real, why would someone who kills another person have the right to appeal?
because they might not have done it ...that not a good enough reason?
because we dont live in iran, or soviet russia ect ect
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Nath
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by Nath
I wondered how this got to 4 pages.
Then I saw Dr Pepper had posted.
I no long wonder.
The End.
Just offering a different opinion from - "hang the bastards" ....sorry
It's ok 
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sc0ott
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Registered: 16th Feb 09
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
They would need to obviously change a shit load to make it work such as more evidance of someone doing the crime before punishment.
Are you for real, why would someone who kills another person have the right to appeal?
because they might not have done it ...that not a good enough reason?
because we dont live in iran, or soviet russia ect ect
Thats why i said more evidence.
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Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
I just find it funny how people use stats and figures from other countries to think it wont work in a country that has a low/slap on the wrist punishment system compared to elsewhere.
what is a "low/slap on the wrist punishment system" ...I have no idea what you are on about
Prisons with luxuries.
Do you get that in america?
no - america has one ofthe hardest prison systems in the world
which is weird?
Because they also have More than one in 100 adults in the United States in jail or prison, an all-time high that is costing state governments nearly $50 billion a year and the federal government $5 billion more, according to a report released this year. The growth in prison population is largely because of tougher state and federal sentencing imposed since the mid-1980s. Minorities have been particularly affected: One in nine black men ages 20 to 34 is behind bars. For black women ages 35 to 39, the figure is one in 100, compared with one in 355 for white women in the same age group.
So they have made prisons harder, they have the death penalty ,,,yet more and more people are offending, and more and more people are going to jail .... an all time high
So how does that prove your point exactly - it proves you wrong
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Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
They would need to obviously change a shit load to make it work such as more evidance of someone doing the crime before punishment.
Are you for real, why would someone who kills another person have the right to appeal?
because they might not have done it ...that not a good enough reason?
because we dont live in iran, or soviet russia ect ect
Thats why i said more evidence.
You cant just get 'more evidence' ...you can only present the evidence you have avaliable .... and let a jury decide guilt or innocence ...you cant just produce more evidence if it looks like its a death sentance offence.
As soon as dna came in - there was a deluge of pardens for people who had been executed because they were innocent. Some times it isnt clear cut .. you need an appeal system, you will have to have one...and it will be unbelievably expensive. In california there are republicans demonstrating against the death penalty - not because they dont agree with it, but because they dont want to pay for it - it costs that state millions of tax funds every year to keep people sitting on death row for decades
Every time you get an advance in criminal science, you will be able to solve lots of older unsolved cases, you will then find that you have wrongly imprisoned, or in the usa, wrongly killed a number of people.
That is why you need death row ..becuase judges are unwilling to send people to death when there is a chance later scientific advances will show they were innocent - so they sit on death row, costing a fortune, going through appeal after appeal..and exactly the same thing would happen if we had it here
You tell me - how does that act as a deterrent, how does it make you safer, how does it make things cheaper or better?
This is why I feel it is an idiotic idea to have it here - I dont think your idiots for wanting criminals punished or hurt .... its just doent help anyone, it doesnt work, it doesnt prevent crime and it costs much more money
[Edited on 15-05-2011 by Dr Pepper]
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Marc
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Registered: 11th Aug 02
Location: York
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quote:
Originally posted by Nath
I wondered how this got to 4 pages.
Then I saw Dr Pepper had posted.
I no long wonder.
The End.
If its like his WC comments, our punishment would be far better than any other countries punishment.
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Dr Pepper
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Registered: 21st Sep 02
Location: oxford Drives Renault Clio RS200
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quote:
Originally posted by Marc
quote:
Originally posted by Nath
I wondered how this got to 4 pages.
Then I saw Dr Pepper had posted.
I no long wonder.
The End.
If its like his WC comments, our punishment would be far better than any other countries punishment.
just stick to your man u armchair fans threads
[Edited on 15-05-2011 by Dr Pepper]
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Nath
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Yeah Marc.
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Marc
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Registered: 11th Aug 02
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Do you truely believe that we have the best politicians in the world that could beat any other countries politicians and their ideas of punishment?
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Marc
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quote:
Originally posted by Nath
Yeah Marc.
Thats me told.
I'm off to OT later this month actually, I think there is a thread about it somewhere 
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John
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Can't have capital punishment in the UK for the simple reason that the police, courts, and the idiots who are allowed to sit on a jury are all completely incompetent, innocent people would be getting beatings and killed all the time and as usual the ones that really deserve it would get away with a £50 fine to be paid back over 13 years.
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sc0ott
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Registered: 16th Feb 09
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Murderers, rapists, wanabe gangsters who knife and shoot people. I would feel more safer if they had no hands or fingers than know they were in jail for a few years.
Theres every chance they would do it again to so inocent person because they werent punished properly.
How wont it work? Have you seen or heard the victims of those whos daughter for example has been murdered for no reason. Do you think the victims families and friends agree with them being sentanced to prison life.
I can just imagine if this happened to one of your close relatives. You would be happy with them being sent to jail. The thing is criminals know what will happen when they are caught and more so probably dont give a fuck if they are sent down to prison.
Maybe if they knew there would be more of a punishment that would remove their eyesight etc they would think about what theu are getting themselves into.
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John
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Registered: 30th Jun 03
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I'd love rapists and murders to be shot, our justice system isn't good enough.
How many criminals do we hear of getting away with no punishment or innocent people being done?
Bringing in corporal or capital punishment just means that the criminals still get found not guilty and there's a massive chance of somebody getting his arm cut off because of some lying policeman in court.
The whole system has to work first and imo it certainly doesn't.
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sc0ott
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Registered: 16th Feb 09
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It would never happen but if we had the choice i would choose death row and or brutal punishment over the eyesore of a system we have now.
You get charged with assualt for sticking up for yourself nowdays. Police say call 999. Wtf do you call 999 after being kicked to death.
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Dr Pepper
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Registered: 21st Sep 02
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quote:
Originally posted by sc0ott
I can just imagine if this happened to one of your close relatives. You would be happy with them being sent to jail. The thing is criminals know what will happen when they are caught and more so probably dont give a fuck if they are sent down to prison.
Maybe if they knew there would be more of a punishment that would remove their eyesight etc they would think about what theu are getting themselves into.
No i wouldnt want them sent to jail - I would want to kill them myself ..... which is exactly why we have a police and criminal system that can make a more rational decision that you or I would with emotions getting involved.
The thing you dont seem to grasp is that you couldnt just find someone guilty - and kill them, or cut their hand off the very next day. It would take years, and millions of pounds ... and if it was your relative that was the victim you would have it dragging on fr decades in some cases.
The very big point that you keep ignoring is that in the countries that have these punishments - murders still happen, violent crime still happens, sexual crime still happens, petty crime still happens ..and all crime is on the increase.
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